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Author Topic: Pirates !  (Read 12093 times)

regiment

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Re: pirates
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2009, 05:26:33 PM »

PROFITS
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Colin Bishop

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Re: pirates
« Reply #26 on: April 15, 2009, 05:27:07 PM »

That has been considered Martin but the shipping companies don't like the idea as they feel it just inflames the situation and there is no guarantee that the on board guards will be sufficient to beat off a determined attack anyway. I believe when it was tried recently the two guards ran out of ammo and had to jump overboard to escape the pirates.

At some point the international community is going to have to take a proper grip on the situation though. At the moment it seems to be only the French who are acting firmly but this can have tragic consequences as the death of the yachtsman last week demonstrated.

Colin
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Roger in France

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Re: pirates
« Reply #27 on: April 15, 2009, 05:43:03 PM »

Yes, sadly the French response resulted in the death of a Frenchman. However, I think this is the only way to go as negotiating or persuading these thugs is a lost cause.

The only things which will improve the situation is a stable government in the country which provides opportunities for its citizens.

Until then (and because such a thing is unlikely for a long, long time) the thugs need to know that there will be violent resistance and rescues which will most likely result in their death.

(And I am a peaceful, wishy-washy liberal!)

Roger in France
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Shipmate60

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Re: pirates
« Reply #28 on: April 15, 2009, 05:57:44 PM »

2 years ago we were transitting an area known for pirate activity.
A small fishing boat came up to us and ordered us to stop to examine our "papers".
They realised they had "made a mistake" when a few dozen Royal Marines with heavy machine guns and grenade launchers popped up and aimed at their ship.
Funnily enough we weren't bothered again!!

Bob
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toesupwa

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Re: pirates
« Reply #29 on: April 15, 2009, 06:02:56 PM »

International law regarding Pirates is a mess...

And British law and US law make the situation even more confusing... http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122757123487054681.html

By the way, piracy on the high seas has been taking place since man first got in to a boat.. Egyptians, Romans, Greeks... they all had problems with piracy.
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Colin Bishop

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Re: pirates
« Reply #30 on: April 15, 2009, 06:08:48 PM »

Even Julius Caesar was captured by pirates and had to be ransomed. I think he got his own back later though!

Colin
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Vintage

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Re: pirates
« Reply #31 on: April 15, 2009, 06:09:58 PM »

Oops...!

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/5/20090330/twl-pirates-shock-as-they-pick-on-the-wr-3fd0ae9.html

"Poor judgment by the pirates turned out to be a real opportunity for seven nations representing three task forces to work together and strike a momentous blow for maritime safety and security."

It did take German, Greek, Dutch & Spanish naval ships together with a Spanish marine aircraft & US marine choppers 5 hours to catch the 7 pirates though  %)
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Garabaldy

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Re: pirates
« Reply #32 on: April 15, 2009, 08:04:57 PM »

there was something on the tv a while ago about a large oil tanker which frequented waters known for piracy and the crews only defense against them were hoses pumping water off the side the ship.  The crew didnt seem to confident in their defense to say the least.

Im probably just being ignorant but how can a small fishing boat board a huge oil tanker if theres no ladders etc...  Or do the pirates have some serious weapons which could sink the ship?

What does everyone think about the americans shooting the 3 pirates holding an american captain?  I thought it was a little risky as the 2nd or 3rd pirate to be shot could have shot the captain in retaliation.  Hey i wasnt there so all i have to go by is what was said in the papers.  Certainly you would think if the pirates were surrouned by a pack of american destroyers they wouldnt have much choice but to surrender?
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Colin Bishop

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Re: pirates
« Reply #33 on: April 15, 2009, 08:17:45 PM »

The pirates use grapnels and ropes to get aboard the ships and they have machine guns and grenade launchers to intimidate the crew - fire hoses are not much of a response there! They don't use fishing boats but fast motor skiffs with powerful outboard motors which can do twice the speed of the target ship.

I would imagine that the recent rescue involved a number of American SEALs (their equivalent of our SBS) on the American naval vessel with sniper guns trained on the pirate's lifeboat at all times (it was being towed by the US ship at the time). All the pirates would have been shot simultaneously. The guns they used would have literally blown the pirates's heads off so not much opportunity for retaliation!

The pirates tried to bluff the Americans on the basis that their friends were coming to their assistance and relying on the complicated situation with International Law. They guessed wrong.

Colin
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tolnedra

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Re: pirates
« Reply #34 on: April 15, 2009, 09:18:39 PM »

As most ships in the Gulf of Aden are heading to or from the Suez Canal, surely it's not rocket science to organise a convoy system? There are apparently Naval vessels from plenty of countries there now, so escorted North bound and South bound convoys shouldn't be too difficult to arrange. Yes, the pirates have high speed skiffs etc, but they would not outrun a helicopter, nor a rigid raider, and warships are unlikely to run out of ammunition, large or small bore, dealing with a few pirates. When is someone in authority going to see sense? >:-o >>:-( >:-o

Danny
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Colin Bishop

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Re: pirates
« Reply #35 on: April 15, 2009, 09:20:42 PM »

Convoy entails delays = extra costs. As Regiment says - Profits!

Some things never change.

Colin
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nhp651

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Re: pirates
« Reply #36 on: April 15, 2009, 09:35:45 PM »

i've been told by a reliable friend that the american forces knew exactly what was going on on the covered boat with highly sensitive listening devices,
they waited till dusk for the light to fail. and using heat sensitive cameras similar to the  thermal imaging cameras, took the three out with ease and with no danger to the hostage captain.........just perfect timing.
and quite brilliant to. :-)) :-))
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Bryan Young

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Re: pirates
« Reply #37 on: April 15, 2009, 10:35:08 PM »

Part of the answer lies with the level of crew manning. Reduced manning means profits for the owners, but leaves the ship vulnerable to not only piracy but inability to deal with any "life-threatening" emergencies that might occur. Like yachtsmen (deep sea type) they rely on "somebody else" to come and rescue them. There are just not sufficient crew members to patrol / guard the ship in areas of high danger. We used to have a minimum manning scale for ships, but this seems to have been ditched through "owners" pressure.
How far offshore do these so-called pirates operate? Seems to me that they are just a bunch of illiterate thugs with access to modern weaponry. In my "commerciial" days around Indonesia it was common practice to fully secure all access points to the interior of the ship. I agree that rocket launchers raise the game a bit but restraining access would be a good start. But at the end of the day it comes down to the level of manning of the ship. BY.
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tigertiger

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Re: pirates
« Reply #38 on: April 16, 2009, 01:58:46 AM »

I read a report on the release of the American MV's captain.
The Captain of the MV had a gun at his head, and it looked like his shooting was imminent.
The Captain of the Navy vessel then gave his snippers (3 I think) permission to take the shot.
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: pirates
« Reply #39 on: October 08, 2009, 09:22:57 AM »


   Pirates hit navy ship 'in error' - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/8296016.stm
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chingdevil

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Re: pirates
« Reply #40 on: October 08, 2009, 09:27:28 AM »

Should have gone to Specsavers
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The long Build

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Re: pirates
« Reply #41 on: October 08, 2009, 01:07:53 PM »

Surprised there were any left to capture.
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toesupwa

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Re: pirates
« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2009, 06:58:06 PM »

Here is the easy answer to pirates... Just ban them due to their dirty engine...  {:-{

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/movies/2010021075_ladywashington08m.html
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Pirates !
« Reply #43 on: January 22, 2010, 01:40:06 PM »



New water cannon to deter pirates from boarding ships

                    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/8473753.stm?ls
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The long Build

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Re: Pirates !
« Reply #44 on: January 22, 2010, 01:59:12 PM »

Does not look that powerful from the footage..
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Patrick Henry

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Re: Pirates !
« Reply #45 on: January 22, 2010, 02:21:03 PM »

Probably a silly comment, but why go there? If the earth is circular, then instead of going through the pirate infested waters, go the other way round...simples.  No?


Rich
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Pirates !
« Reply #46 on: January 22, 2010, 02:53:35 PM »

Quote
Probably a silly comment, but why go there? If the earth is circular, then instead of going through the pirate infested waters, go the other way round...simples.  No?

Few ships do round the world voyages. If you are going fro A to B then visiting Z,Y,X etc. on the way is maybe not the most advantageous route....
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cos918

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Re: Pirates !
« Reply #47 on: January 22, 2010, 03:19:52 PM »

rich the Suez canal is one bit short cut from east to west. Saves Shipping company thousands in fuel bill and time ,so that's why they go that why and take the risk.

John
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tolnedra

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Re: Pirates !
« Reply #48 on: January 22, 2010, 05:32:53 PM »

The shipping companies don't take the risk, other than financial of course, it's the poor seafarers on the ships who take the risks - no change there then!
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DickyD

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Re: Pirates !
« Reply #49 on: January 22, 2010, 05:46:19 PM »

Does not look that powerful from the footage..
They reckon that with the right pumps, the water jet is like being hit on the head with the large size bowling ball.
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