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Author Topic: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203  (Read 81386 times)

Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2009, 06:00:08 PM »

The frames are all roughed out and ready to be hung on the keel so the next job is to tackle the back bone of the ship.

I have chosen some Sapele hardwood for my keel as it was easy to obtain a decent length from my local timber merchant. I had it machined to the required 13mm thickness to match the keel width while I was there to make my life easier.

At home I cut the board into 50mm planks as I have decided my back bone is going to be 50mm x 13mm in section, of which 12mm projects below the guard boards forming the ships visible keel.

My drawings show the keel projecting 15mm below the guard boards and this is so that when the hull is completed I can plane the keel down to size. This was done so that any knocks and dings the keel might receive during planking will be planed away leaving a straight keel with clean sharp edges.

Taking my my No.4 Stanley Plane in hand sharpened using the scary sharp system of sharpening the blade I can get lovely clean faces to my keel and dead woods, even the end grain is as shiny as a bald mans pate and as smooth as a babies bum! :-)) {-) leaving me with a heap of see through shavings. See photo.

I get my wood flat and square by taking off very fine shavings and then checking for squareness and straightness. If things are not true I mark the high spots with blue marker pen and play the game of shave off the blue bits {-) :-)) This relieves the tediousness of the job and hones my planing accuracy.

I have a roll of tracing paper between my drawing and the wood components so that I don't draw on the plans while setting out the back bone. The parts are pinned to the building board through the plans to hold them in place while I make all the components.

I use lego parts to form set squares, these help me transfer lines directly from the drawings to the top surface of parts I need to cut out on the band saw very accurately. Lego is perfectly square on all sides and I find it a useful setting out tool. See photos

Next time, gluing the parts forming the back bone, setting out and cutting the stem and stern post profiles and setting out the rabbet to receive the planking.
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #26 on: November 01, 2009, 06:48:36 PM »

My plywood used for the frames has shrunk! :o

It is supposed to be 12.7mm thick or 1/2 inch?

A stack of 9 frames cut from this plywood measures 101.7mm instead of 114.3mm! >>:-(

Good job this ain't the space station I'm building! ;) :-)) and I can adjust things to suit.

Ah the joys of scratch building! {-)
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #27 on: November 02, 2009, 06:46:40 PM »

The keel members were glues together last night and this evening I've begun to cut the rabbet to receive the planks.

I make a start cutting the rabbet now as it's much easier while the keel is clamped flat to my building board. I don't cut the full depth but about 1/2 mm shallower so that I might finish off the groove as each planks comes to meet the rabbet during planking of the hull.

The rabbet is the point at which the outer face of a plank meets the stem post, stern post and keel and the bearding line is where the inside face of a plank meets same.

These can be plotted from the plan sections for the keel, and the water lines for the stem and stern post. See close up photo of setions showing plotted plank edges where they meet the keel below. :-))

Master Hand's planks scale 4mm thick as near as makes no difference so I have marked this on the edge of my chisel so that when I start bashing away with me mallet I know how deep to cut. The angle of my cuts are guided by my guard board plank edge plotted on my sections.

The chisel blade represents the inner face of the planks and its side represents the edge of the planks. See photo below.

The next photo shows the progression along the rabbet groove, the chisel is propped up at the beginning of cutting, and progresses the the finished rabbet groove towards the bottom of the photo.

I make cuts with the chisel as shown working along the groove taking out little sections as I go to a rough depth.

When I have done this for an inch or so I go back and smooth off the face making sure I have gone no deeper than 4mm at the rabbet, feathering off to nothing at the bearding line, all the while following what my sections on the plans show me and transferred to each section plotted on the side of the keel.

Now I play the shave off the blue bits again. :-)) O0

What I am after is a smooth transition along the rabbet groove as the angle is constantly changing, governed by the 4mm depth at the rabbet to nothing at the bearding line. I use my chisel as a scraper by holding the blade vertical to the groove face and drawing the chisel towards me.

I am aided by daubing blue indelible pen on the straight edge of a scrap of plank wood and rubbing it up and down the rabbet groove. High spots are indicated by the blue bits in the groove which I shave off. Do not shave off at the rabbet or the bearding line as these define the groove.

The photo shows the blue spots that need to come off and I keep going until everything is blue indicating a flat even surface.This takes some time to complete and is not particularly necessary but I like to follow full size ship building practice in this area as it forms a very good gluing and nailing surface for the plank hood ends and the bottom edge of the guard board.

Next time, setting up the frames on the building board and fitting the keel. :-))
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Greggy1964

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Cuttiung rabbet cont'd Don't try this at home kids!
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2009, 05:00:59 PM »

I've had a couple of frustrating days with no work done on the keel >:-o life just gets in the way! {-)

But during this time I've been thinking I have the need for a 4mm plank so that I can dury fit the guard board while the keel is clamped to my building board for cutting the rabbet.

I have temporarily super glued bits of obechi to the side of the keel to the same profile as the frames and glued at the frame stations.

This gives me the correct angles along the keel at which the guard board meets it when a scrap plank is bent into place. It gives me a visual on how to accurately cut the constantly changing bevel in the side of the keel.

In the first two photos below are two shots of a straight plank clamped in place with my baby spring clamps which provide sufficient force to hold the twisting plank in place except at either end where slightly more force is required. This I have done with 1" dressmakers pins set in pilot holes drilled with my pin drill.

The rabbet from frame 12 (midship frame) to the bow has not been cut yet and the guard board blank is laying flush with the side of the keel and tight up against the dury frames giving me its correct shape.

The plank is a scrap piece of hardwood and will be used as a template for the oak version which will be fixed to the hull.

As you can see the plank lies quite nicely and I can see how the rabbet has to be cut :-))

My idea to bring the planks to correct thickness was to use my power planer, but turned upside down in such a way that I could feed thicker planks through the blade giving me nice smooth faces and to the thickness I need for planking. O0

What I have come up with works quite well provided the planks have parallel faces to begin with.

The planer is clamped upside down to my workmate, a lump of softwood is clamped all across the length of the sole, to the side of which are clamped two weighted tumblers.

These tumblers are fixed one before and one after the rotating blades in such a way that my pink wiggly bits on the ends of my wrists connot come into contact with the blades. :-)) O0 but the tumblers are allowed to moved upwards and rock forwards and backwards.

The idea being that a plank fed through the planer will be held to the sole while planing is done and all I do is feed a plank in one end and pull it out the other in one smooth movement.

Getting the right thickness is a bit hit and miss to start with but the best way is to shave off only a tiny amount and keep feeding the plank through the planer until your happy :-)) ;)

A 50" plank takes about 30 seconds in one pass which ain't too bad O0

Next time, cutting and fitting a guard board and fitting to the rabbet.
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Greggy1964

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Thinking of planking . . . . . .
« Reply #29 on: November 05, 2009, 04:27:06 PM »

Introducing 'Our Lass' :-))

She's a 200mm long solid carved balsa model I knocked up years ago to help me visualise how Master Hand's hull form looked when I built the first hull at 1/20 scale afew years ago.

When planking a curvaceous hull, novice builders get into a right pickle {:-{ (including myself when I started out) because they try to bend straight planks around a hull form that curves in three dimensions.

They say a picture paints a thousand words  O0 . . . . . . .

Photos 1 & 2 show Our Lass with a bilge plank drawn on her side in blue pen. It is how I have decided I want that particular plank to run.

Photos 3, 4 & 5 show a strip of card with parallel sides which I want to plank Our Lass with. The card plank has been laid around the hull but allowed to follow it's natural form, i.e. keeping it straight and bending in two planes only.

Wood planks behave in exactly the same way as the cardboard plank.

When I try to force our straight plank to conform to the blue plank run on the hull I find the top edge follows the line of the blue plank perfectly . . . . . . BUT! as can be seen in photos 6 through 10 the bottom edge is lifting away from Our Lass's hull.

This is the typical of the stepped look a novice gets when trying to bend straight planks around their hull.

Planking part two next  :-))



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Greggy1964

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Thinking of planking . . . . . . part 2
« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2009, 04:36:46 PM »

Planking continued :-))

Getting back to 'Our Lass's' bottom! {-)

Photos 11, 12 & 13 Now I have taken some tracing paper and cut it roughly to follow the blue plank run BUT I make it wide so it has plenty of room to naturally bend to the hull but in two planes and not three.

Already you can start to see the tracing paper take on a curve in outline but it lies flat to the hull along the blue plank run. :-))

I trace exactly the blue plank run while the tracing paper is pinned along the blue plank line, notice the changing angle of the pins along the run. Each pin was deliberately driven in perpendicular to the hull face at that point, it shows quite graphically the three dimensional - almost helix twist the blue plank takes as it runs around the hull.

The tracing paper is lifted off the hull and laid out flat and compared to the original straight cardboard plank. Photo 14.

The tracing is transferred to another sheet of flat card and cut out. Photos 15 through 18 show the new plank lying exactly along the blue plank line with no lifting edges.

I hope this demonstration of planking with the help of 'Our Lass' and her photos assist folks get their heads around planking :-)) O0

If you're wondering, Our Lass originally had a mizzen mast, bowsprit and a proper heel to the keel at the stern . . . . but one of my kittens decided I didn't feed him enough! >>:-( %) {-)

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dreadnought72

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #31 on: November 05, 2009, 07:41:25 PM »

Excellent methodology Greg - and this rabbet guide for the garboard (and later) plank(s):



...speaks volumes.

Regarding the splining, it's a black art at first glimpse, but I think the use of well-marked formers, plenty of card, and a few attempts at cuts, is always the way to go.

Meanwhile, kittens! Ah yes ... I know their habits all too well.



They can be terrors.

He is.

Andy
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #32 on: November 05, 2009, 11:04:33 PM »

Hello Andy,

Your comments are most welcome, nothing will please me more than if I can impart the knowlege I have learned and demystify subjects like planking for others.

To encourage another builder so that they attempt a scratch build is my aim.

I'm getting the hang of the write ups now, its just doing baby steps so I don't miss stuff out and keeping it in small chunks.

Some of my methods may be a tad unorthordox but if it gets a result who cares?  {-)

I'm hoping that if I do miss a step and leave folks going ''eh? how did he get to that point?'' they will ask me to go through it for them. I don't mind.

Your kitten is beautiful :-)) We have a bit of a zoo here, 3 adult cats, two kittens and two German Shepherds  . . . . . . I know what your thinking  :o . . . . yes they all get on like one big happy family? O0 {-)
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Greggy1964

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Planking half a potato
« Reply #33 on: November 05, 2009, 11:38:49 PM »

I can hear you say ''Oh yeah but he can carve posh hulls out of wood :(( not me though!''

You don't need to be able to carve fancy little hulls to learn to plank, just grab a used cereal box for the card and a reasonably symmetrical potato and a bunch of dress makers pins.

Sounds silly huh? :o {-) O0

Its a cheap way to learn to plank a hull and it will get you going without ruining you new boat project - its how I taught my self!

If you can get little planks to form around a half a potato you can plank anything, try lapstrake or carvel forms of planking. %)

Cut the potato in half and mash one side and eat it  {-) you only need one half {-)

Give it a centre line for the keel and mark off roughly a few station lines where the frames would go on a model boat hull.

Decide how many planks per side and  divide each station off with the number of chosen planks, you will notice each plank will taper towards the ends of the potato.

Follow the steps outlined above and also review my planking write up here

http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=19469.0

Keep it in the crisper in your fridge till your done to avoid things going manky in the build process if it's taking you a while, though watch out for the odd looks and comments from the missus! {-)

If you paint the result with a coat or two of pva glue on the outside before unpinning it from the potato you will end up with a beautiful tiny coracle that you will be so proud of :-))

If it don't work out, bin it and start again. Practice makes perfect. :-))

Works on apples too! ok2 :-)
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2009, 11:03:17 PM »

What follows is a series of photos of the rabbet cut at the bow and hopefully shows you the sequence of events to get the desired results. . . . . . .

Photo 1 is a close up of the rabbet cut at frame 1, I do this at each frame along the keel at my dummy frame positions to gauge the angle of cut

Using these part rabbets as a guide I join up the rabbet groove between frames.

Photo 2 shows the chisel being used with guide depth marked on the blade to gauge depth of cut.

Photo 3 shows the bow with rabbet, rabbet back and bearding line and a small test piece of plank sat in the rabbet at frame one to check for fit.

Photo 4 shows close fit of test plank piece in rabbet, I'm aiming to get it this close all along the rabbet from bow to stern.

Photo 5 is a long shot down the finished rabbet groove from the bow, the rabbet groove from frame 6 to frame 14 is a simple 'V' groove and has yet to be cut.

Photo 6  %) I couldn't resist {-) I had to make a template from card to see how things would lay. I use card board templates to get a snug fit to the planking.

Photo 7 shows how the guard board template fits snug in the rabbet at the bow.

Photo 8  ;) well I couldn't just stop at a template could I? ;) {-)  

I took  a 300mm long scrap of planking material and cut the bow end of the 16mm wide x 4mm thick guard board and tried it for fit, shaving a bit off the edge here, test fitting, shaving a bit there, bit by bit until I get a snug fit.

Again I used the blue patch high spot trick by daubing the edge of the plank with blue marker pen (soft children's blackboard chalk works too) and pressing the plank in place before the pen has time to dry.

Then I play my save off the blue spots again.

For a long plank I would daub a short length and hold the plank in place, take it away and daub the next section along and re fit. I do this all along the plank and only then do I check for blue spots and shave off the blue high spots all along the plank.

I use a chisel held perpendicular to the plank edge while the plank is held in my cheapo work mate :-)) and draw it along the plank like a cabinet scraper to remove a fine shaving only where the blue spots are.

You might find a few high spots in the rabbet too but take care you don't remove too much.

I cannot stress enough that for good results the chisel blade must be sharp O0

It takes a while but is it worth it for the satisfaction you get from the results.

Photo 9 shows the forefoot & keel at the bow and a close view of the hood end of the guard board. The keel is 13mm wide to get an idea of scale.

Photo 10 is meant the show the nailing details at the hood end, I'm using 16mm x 0.65mm steel dressmakers pins to hold the plank in place. No glue at this stage, it's just a dummy run at this point. The pins are set in holes bored with a 0.5mm steel dress makers pin set in a pin vice which is in turn held in my 18V battery drill.

This gives my nails/pins bite and as you can see they don't split the delicate hood end of the plank.

Photo 11 shows the curve of the top edge of the guard board, this boat is gonna have some pretty curves O0 :-))

Also I am experimenting with the caulking seam, you can see this in photo 11.

Master Hand was work boat and the caulked plank seams were a prominent feature. At 1/16th scale they would be visible so I am opening up the seam between the planks to just wider than a scale seam. When I seal and paint the outside of the hull the sealing treatment will flow into the caulking groove between planks and hopefully give a caulked seam look. ;)

I do this by painting the edge of one of adjoining planks to two thirds the thickness of the plank from the out side face. I take my sharp little no. 110 Stanley plane and just shave off the blue bit all along the plank edge.

The caulking groove is about as wide as the thickness of three sheets of A4 photo copy paper.

Photo 12 shows the inside face of the guard board where it meets the bearding line, its a snug fit and I'm pleased with my efforts.

The rabbet groove does not have to be cut with surgical precision, just as long as it is even and smooth along its length. When the guard board is finally fitted, its inner edge will be cut to match the rabbet groove whatever its shape may be.

That said it is worth taking time to get these first planks next to the keel fitted neatly, they are the most difficult planks to fit properly and are the foundation for the rest of the planks to come. :-))
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Greggy1964

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More thoughts on planking . . . . . . . .
« Reply #35 on: November 07, 2009, 11:45:22 AM »

If you are wondering . . . . .

The 4mm thick by 16mm wide test guard board plank was bent in cold, no steaming at all. O0 :-))

Hardwood it seems to me to work better than softwoods but it's just my opinion and it takes nails and pins better.

The plank is going to want to return to its straight flat shape and will resist being bent around your hull. Softwoods will try and pull the pin heads through the plank in order to return to it's straight state.

This gives the impression of the pin heads being countersunk with a small gap being found between the frame face and the back face of the plank as the plank has pulled away from the frame.

Hardwood planks are not as soft and this phenomenon is less pronounced.

Of course I'm talking here of planks being held by nails and glue with no other clamping force being used while the glue sets.

You can see from the photo below how the test guard board takes on a severe twist but it is only held in place by 16mm x 0.65 pins alone - no glue either :-)) also it shows the pin drill I use to make the pilot holes through the planks and into the keel to take pins/nails.

The tiny crack from pin 3 was not caused by the pin being driven but occurred prior to the hole being bored and while twisting the plank into place, but is of no consequence. The pins are staggered one up, one down along the bottom edge of the plank towards it's hood end as a trick to avoid splitting the delicate plank edge. See top photo below.

Using nails or pins to hold the planks in place means planking can progress quickly avoiding the waiting time for planks glued and clamped to dry, four to six planks being laid per session instead of two or may be four planks being laid by the latter method.

I use clamps initially to hold the plank in place while the pins are driven, but then take them away to be used for the next plank.

Don't fall into the trap of thinking that if you used thinner planks they would bend in easier, they do I agree!

But there is a price to pay!  O0 Thinner planks tend to take on an angular profile taking a tight bend as they pass each frame and then curving between frames exactly like the edge of a 50 pence piece.  The only way to avoid this is by using very close spaced frames which is unnecessary and costly.

Thicker planks will spring around wider spaced frames following the sweet curves on your building plan, and if you taper the planks correctly end to end you are reducing the cross section of the plank anyway and effectively thinning the ends which will easily bend into place.

The guard board and the 2nd plank on this ship are parallel sided and straight with the 2nd plank gradually widening out from 16mm amidships to 35mm at the heel of the stern post.

You may have noticed that the guard board does not run the full length of the keel but finishes short of the stern post - the edge of the rabbet further aft meeting the bottom edge of plank 2.

The reason for this is that the plank would be vertical at this point and you would only be cutting away deadwood and keel to replace the same with plank at a point where everything is narrow anyway.

The original builders would have been building to a budget and anything that would have wasted time and materials was avoided.
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Greggy1964

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Playing at shaving off the blue bits
« Reply #36 on: November 08, 2009, 06:39:47 PM »

Photo 1 When you see this much blue  O0 . . . . . . .

Stop! :-))

Your getting obsessive! O0 {-)

Photo 2  Same area shaved off

In the photos, the nearest bottom left is my tiny sanding block which is simply 360 grade wet'n'dry glued to a flat piece of planking stock, next comes my bit of plank all daubed blue which I rub up and down the rabbet groove to find my high spots and then comes my blue marker.

When the surface gets this blue the groove is so smooth you can practically see your face in it when it's cleaned up!  {-)

Another point to be noted is that while running the little blue block along the rabbet groove, you will notice tiny up and and down movements transmitted to your fingers which will indicate unfair undulations.

If you don't care to get your fingers all blue, just run the hardwood block without, high spot will become polished when viewed under bright light. :-))

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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #37 on: November 09, 2009, 01:40:14 PM »

The rabbet is now complete on the port side, so now we flip over and do it all again {-)

But to do so, I have to remove the false frames and the test guard board plank.

The false frame removal was easy, snap off at the base and clean up the superglue on the wood surface with a sharp chisel.

But . . . . . .

Because I had driven the pins flush with the plank that hold it in place I couldn't pull at the pin heads with pliers. The plank was held so firmly in place I was forced to use pliers to break the plank apart, destroying it in the process. >>:-(

Pity - but needs must when the devil poo's in yer custard!  <*< onwards and upwards!

At least it proves my nailing method works in holding planks down while glue dries! :-))

The little cuts that can be seen on the bearding line at the forefoot are the remains of the vertical cuts through the wood fibres at the keel surface. This is done to prevent the wood fibres tearing as I'm cutting the shallow angles involved due to the orientation of the wood grain at that point.

I would have liked a grown crook for the forefoot area as used in the real ship but beggars can't be choosers while rooting unsuccessfully in the wood yard! {-)

The groove is tiny and will fill up with cascamite when the real plank is put in place, I guess I'm just being picky! <*< O0
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Greggy1964

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Plank nailing experiments . . . . . . . . . .
« Reply #38 on: November 10, 2009, 12:37:30 AM »

I've been playing with 22mm wide x 4mm thick planks and nailing them to a block of oak 46mm wide x 22mm thick.

I'm using 16mm x 0.65mm shaft diameter steel dress makers pins as nails driven into holes bored by a 0.5mm diameter pin held in a pin vice which is in turn is held in an 18 volt Ryobi battery drill.



You can see the pins and their lid in the back ground, I have probably enough pins there to nail the planks to one side of my trawler hull, all for 1.95 . . . . expensive huh? {-)



I've been driving the pins in with a old 10oz Stanley ball pin type hammer via a pin punch as close to the edge of the blank as possible just out of badness <*< . . . . . . . .



and right up to the hood end of the plank.

The nail/pin heads are 1.65mm in diameter to get an idea how close :-)) and no plank splitting neither! ;D

Here are two nails in the middle of the plank, one partially driven home and one pointing to its hole.



And here are two photos of a block of wood 45mm x 38mm in section forced under the plank 170mm away from the closest nails, no glue remember?



I think you can see this plank is going nowhere fast! :-)) O0

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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #39 on: November 10, 2009, 10:44:10 PM »

I was rummaging in the tool section of my local cheapy shop today and I found a set of these



They are hollow tipped nail punches and come in three head sized, this is the smallest and fits the heads of my 16mm pins/nails perfectly :-))



Further more if I drive the pins into the plank to counter sink them I can use hardwood cocktail sticks to dowel the holes just like the real ship! :-)) :-)



The bottom two nails on the right in the above photo I got a bit carried away with :embarrassed: I tapped them in too hard and drove them right through the plank <*< that is why the plank split at this point O0 {-)

And all six counter sunk nails on the right have fluff in them from sanding the dowels on the left six.

I drove the nails in close together to see how much punishment my 22mm wide x 4mm deep oak plank would take and I'm quite happy with the results :-))

When planking the model I plan to nail the planks while the glue dries, and rather than faff about pulling out all the nails when planking is done I'm simply going to countersink them and dowel them as above. O0

On the photos of my previous post you can see that the pin heads have been damaged by the flat face of the punch I was prevoisly using to drive the pins home, but the new punch does not deform the heads, nor does it slip causing the pins to bend. :-))
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Jimmy James

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #40 on: November 11, 2009, 02:00:21 PM »

Greg
 In Lowestoft is a full sized sailing trawler used as a sail training ship "Endeavour".. I think they have a web site if not Lowestoft Harbour could give you contact numbers
 They sail in the tall ship races and do cruses around the UK ,Ireland and Europe if you need info, photos or a trip etc--- I'm sure they would be glad to help...
 I THINK IT IS THE ENDEAVOR TRUST Lowestoft (Not sure of the spelling)
Freebooter :-))
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Jimmy James

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #41 on: November 11, 2009, 08:16:49 PM »

Greg
Just checked it's  "Excelsior LT472" Lowestoft sailing smack
 www.excelsiortrust.co.uk
not endeavor
Freebooter
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #42 on: November 11, 2009, 11:10:13 PM »

Hello Jimmy James,

Thank you for your interest and the information, I am aware of the Excelsior Trust and the courageous efforts to keep this important piece of our sailing history afloat.

It may be of interest for those who wish to build models of these graceful ships, and who are following my build log here, that the Excelsior trust sell copies of the line drawings and sail plan of the Excelsior.

I my self have a set of drawings of Excelsior and if Master Hand makes a successful radio controlled model at 1/16 scale I intend in the future to build models of Excelsior LT472 and also of Ibex BM27, the fastest sailing trawler to sail out of Brixham and also a model of the Brixham mule William & Sam BM352, all at 1/16 scale.

Excelsior is able to provide me with real life details of how these ships were handled and sailed in connection with this build log.

Other sailing trawlers still in existence are Vigilance BM76, Deodar former LT453, Keewaydin former LT1192, Pilgrim BM45, Boy Leslie (the last flagship of the Blue Flag Fleet) BM312 now in Denmark, Kenya Jacaranda former Torbay Lass BM163 and Lord Nelson, one of the largest of them all built for Grimsby owners in 1885, now based in Sweden.

Also the City of Edinboro H1394 and later named the Willian McCann which was part of the Excelsior Trust up until 2004 but I believe she was broken up after breaking her back in a dry dock incident.

I may be wrong on this last point and if anyone can shed any further light on this last ship I would be grateful.
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #43 on: November 11, 2009, 11:34:14 PM »

I am currently cutting the rabbet on the starboard side of the keel and hopefully in the next day or two I will be finally setting up the keel on the building board with the frames





and getting to grips with planking :-))

P.S. The wine is not obligatory but coupled with the favourite tunes booming from the stereo . . . . . . it helps things along :-)) O0 {-)
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #44 on: November 12, 2009, 07:41:16 AM »



Ahhh! That's the tool I'm missing, produce of the vine lubrication!    :-))
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #45 on: November 12, 2009, 10:02:37 AM »

 {-) O0 {-) O0 {-) O0

Helps enormously :-))
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Jimmy James

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #46 on: November 12, 2009, 05:22:12 PM »

Use it all the time --- help's keep the job running smoothly--- Surprised you with your connections never used it Martin.
Greg
Thanks for the added info
Jimmy
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Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #47 on: November 13, 2009, 04:16:14 PM »

I'm getting to the end of cutting the rabbet on the starboard side of the keel now,



As I've mentioned before the rabbet along the length of keel from Stn. 14 to Stn. 4 (we have frames at stations scaled 2 meters apart from the face of the stem and numbered stem to stern).

Near the edge of the chisel can be seen a little carboard template, this held at Stn. 2 gives me the correct angle of cut from the bearding line into the groove. It was transferred from the drawings and I have similar templates for the waterlines.

But from Stn. 4 forward into the forefoot the angles in the groove start to change dramatically as can be seen above, and we need to get this right if our planks are to sit properly.

The way I do this is to take a small section of plank cut to the correct thickness and sit it in the rabbet so that the outside face of the plank matches the rabbet line and the inside face meets the bearding line. Using the sections and water lines marked on the side of the keel I have reference points that I can work back to the line drawings.



In the photo above you can see my little plank bit set in the rabbet at Stn. 2, I set the plank roughly how the planks will run in relationship to the groove and I'm only interested in the end face of the plank and how it sits in the rabbet groove at that particular point.

Using Station 2 and waterlines LL6 through LL0 as reference points I roughly cut out the rabbet at these points and then cut out the remaining rabbet between these points carefully matching it all up.



Above, plank bit for fit at LL6



Above, plank bit for fit at LL5



At Stn.4 I'm using the bottom edge of the plank bit and the front corner edge to check for fit, as you can see I've gone a tad mad and cut a fraction too deep :o >>:-( . . . . . .

But nobody is perfect!  ;)

Least of all me.  {-) O0

The same happened sometimes in the real ship yards and planks hood ends were packed out with thin shims of wood :o O0, I will do the same so it's not the end of the world. :-))

You can see just above LL4 the point to which I have cut the rabbet so far and from right to left above can be seen the rabbet line, rabbet back line and bearing lines to which I cut the groove.

Between water line LL0 and the top if the stem the planks form a vertical wall from stem to stern.

The ship was designed to have vertical sides from the water line to top of rail so that the fishermen working the trawl had an easier life hauling the trawl aboard.

This coupled with the straight vertical stem means the rabbet will go back to being a straight groove from waterline LL0 upwards which makes life simpler in cutting the rabbet groove. :-))

When I'm happy with things so far I take tiny blocks of wood faced with various grades of wet & dry glass paper and rub the non papered corners up and down the groove daubed in marker pen as before.



High spots are graphically picked out as seen above and we play shave off the black bits this time! :-)) ;) but only in the groove, never at the rabbet or bearding line. :-))
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dreadnought72

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #48 on: November 13, 2009, 06:55:35 PM »

As they say in the world of the internet,

nom nom nom

 %%

Here's one of the nicest rabbets I've seen in the real world ever:



(That's the half-finished stem from a guy making a catboat on the wooden boat forum - full size - and his woodwork is a marvel. But you can't go read that thread Greg, because he's slower than I am, and you'll not have time to show us what's next!!)

Andy
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Enjoying every minute sailing W9465 Mertensia

Greggy1964

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Re: 3/4" to the foot model of Lowestoft Sailing Trawler Master Hand LT1203
« Reply #49 on: November 13, 2009, 08:26:07 PM »

Yeah tis lovely I confess :-)) :kiss: O0 :kiss: {-) {-)

I like the saw cuts to find the bevelled stem side faces, neat trick! :-))

The waste stuff comes off in lumps when bashed with a chisel from the sides and you keep going till there is no more saw cut and plane up till your there :-))

Mustn't go look though, I'll never get anything done! Resist! resist!  Arrrrggghhh! {-)

I'm a frustrated full size boat builder myself >>:-( :((

I got to be content with models O0

*sigh!* :-)) ok2

One day!
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