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Author Topic: HMS Illustrious 87  (Read 109283 times)

Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #275 on: March 24, 2017, 04:27:43 PM »

So have a few days visiting vehicle body shops and paint suppliers,  I think I may have found the the match required, but would like a few others to give me their conclusion.  There are three turrets, one in the correct colour one with the match I have found and one with just varnish over the primer.  Can any one tell me which is the original and which is the match found.
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John W E

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #276 on: March 24, 2017, 05:37:57 PM »

Hi ya Paul

Painting warship/any model is a bit of a 'complicated business' or should we say 'various train of thoughts' because there are those who say - we should paint the model the exact colours as the 'real I am' ship, even going to the extent of using the exact paint that was used.   There are also those (like me) who think that once this ship is away from you and on the lake - it doesn't really matter how close the colour is to the 'real I am ' as long as it looks right.  A friend who used to be a bit of an amateur artist as well as a modeller used to say an artist doesn't paint the object the same colour as it is - use shades of a similar colour.   He suggested to me to try that - especially on me warships as a fully grey warship painted in one shade of grey doesn't look right - so subtle changes in the colouring tends to enhance the look of the model.   Unless, of course, you are like me who had a model rejected in a competition because he saw I had used various shades of grey on HMS York - and when I tried to explain the theory behind me painting it this way - it wasn't accepted.   Because, obviously when closeup to a model say 6 inches away - you can tell the difference and subtle changes. 

So before trying to get the exact colouring match - think of the size of your model - and are you going to enter it into competitions - does it really matter if the colour/shading is a little bit 'out'.

just food for thought

John
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radiojoe

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #277 on: March 24, 2017, 06:36:58 PM »


Hi Paul,  it's difficult as colours are going to look different on different PC's depending on how the colour is set up, but number 1 would be acceptable as far as I can see, but not being a rivet counter I think if it looks right to the builder nothing else matters.  :-))


Joe
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ballastanksian

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #278 on: March 24, 2017, 09:41:25 PM »

Too right, add to that the real life efffect of abrasive salt, sun fade and areas being repainted at different times with what were probably different batches of 'Grey'.

I reckon that #1 is the varnished one, #2 is the original while #3 is the match.

Great debates have been had on the correct shade of Olive Drab and German 'Dunkelgelb' in Military modelling circles, but in the end the same issues apply added to that is weathering and you have a movable feast. Objects further away also look lighter and with less brilliance so scale effect has relevence.

Judges be darned, build it how you want it and accept that like all artists, we are our own critics, but you have to let a project alone at some point or you will never move on to your next project.
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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #279 on: March 24, 2017, 09:53:57 PM »


I reckon that #1 is the varnished one, #2 is the original while #3 is the match.


I'll go along with Ian's choice - it can't be no.1 because the shine around the rim indicates a varnish has been applied. %)

But whatever the shade - if it looks right then it is right. :-)

Regards,

Ray.
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #280 on: March 26, 2017, 05:04:33 PM »

The original is number 3 and the match is number 2.  I am pleased that I have found a match that is close enough to paint the model and not really worry about someone saying that is not the correct colour. It will work well with different areas so the effect of repainting will not stand out. Also the slight diferent shades will help when painting other areas as pointed out by other.


The match came from A. Halfords and a local body shop.  But the test was done on the Halford primer.  Will post photos of the can to help others find a reasonable match in a large quantity spray can without breaking the bank


Thanks for the help in this.
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #281 on: April 10, 2017, 02:55:19 PM »

Got down to some painting and finally finished off the underside of the hull ready to have the prop shaft filled with grease before I reinstate the prop shaft and rudder.   Any one got an Idea to how to fill the shaft with the minimum of fuss.


Also completed the making of the 8 ft Carly rafts in batches of two and have bonded them to their positions in the support frame which will be bonded to the side of the island. Just to prime and paint once the bonding has cured and then install the silk strapping to simulate the striping which holds them in place ready for deployment. 
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Geoff

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #282 on: April 10, 2017, 03:05:53 PM »

Looking very good and pleased to see the progress. A comment on colour if I may, I'm with the people who see that from a distance colour is different from close up. Whilst you have painted the underwater hull red may I suggest you have a look at Humbrol 72 (I think)  which is wine as this looks very effective on the lake as its not too bright - that scale effect again!

Look forward to more updates and pictures

Cheers

Geoff
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radiojoe

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #283 on: April 10, 2017, 03:40:46 PM »


Hi Paul . all looking very smart,  you mention "filling" the shafts, IMO shafts/tubes should never be "filled" this causes far too much drag all that is normally required is to smear the shafts with a thin grease, I use Robbe shaft grease,  then assemble shafts and inject a small "plug" of grease though the greaser tubes as a water stop,  but like I said this is just my opinion.


Joe.
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #284 on: April 10, 2017, 04:26:41 PM »

Your point is noticed, but my three prop shaft are all below the water line.  While the two outer shafts have prop shaft end blocks with rubber silicon washers to help prevent any water entering the shafts, the centre shaft has no such methods other then to ensure the front end of the shaft has a bit of water proof grease to stop any water ingress.  Thinking of this.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/391351329285


 
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Geoff

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #285 on: April 10, 2017, 04:36:24 PM »

I've always just used a small syringe with lithium based grease to push some into the prop shaft and then work the prop shaft in with your finger over the other end to stop the grease being pushed out. As above you don't want too much  as otherwise too much drag but I've used this method for years and literally any leakage is absolutely limited to just a few drops. I tend to use the outside end of the prop shaft as the thrust bearing (with a couple of small washers) and again I've not had any issues with this.

Cheers

Geoff
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radiojoe

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #286 on: April 10, 2017, 07:02:38 PM »


If you don't have greasers I'd do what Geoff said and just have a "plug" of grease at the motor end, the shafts on my Brocklesby are below the water line but I've used Raboasch water proof shafts you don't need any grease in these but I always assemble them smeared with grease.


Joe
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ballastanksian

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #287 on: April 10, 2017, 08:35:24 PM »

I put silicone grease into my shafts; enough to do what Joe and geoff said about plugging but not dragging the shafts.

If going down the Humbrol route (indeed for any smaller quantity tinlet/bottle paint) buy a box of them and you should benefit from them being of the same production batch.

She is looking very impressive now even upside down  :-))
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #288 on: April 12, 2017, 04:09:02 PM »

All points noted and will work on the principle that the shaft has a slight lubrication and the ends have some grease to act as a stopper. I will hope the silicone washer will seal the shaft 
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Geoff

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #289 on: April 13, 2017, 02:18:49 PM »

As has been pointed out she looks very impressive even upside down. Lets trust this is the last picture we will see of her upside down!


Cheers


Geoff
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #290 on: April 13, 2017, 02:25:18 PM »

She is the correct way up at the moment, fitting the boat decks and cutting out the top decks for the search lights aft and the HF range finders aft.   Then cut outs for the two cranes.  The flight deck also has to be cut to match these decks.  Will post photos when one side is complete and then move to the other side.  That will then complete the rear section of the the flight deck.   Only have to cut out the rear air craft lift and work out how to secure the flight deck and still have access to the inside.
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #291 on: April 15, 2017, 05:36:24 PM »

This is the first side were all the aft deck cut outs along with the two sea boat decks have been installed and the rear section of the flight deck is in place.  Now working on the other side and these cut out sections are not identical to the other side.


Also completed the island Carly float deck.   All painted and the strapping in place to add detail to this section of the build.   It will be bonded to the island when the island has been painted and fitted out and positioned on the flight deck.
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ballastanksian

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #292 on: April 15, 2017, 07:51:53 PM »

If the rest of your Lusty is as detailed as the carley deck then it will be a superb model. I love the straps on the floats, a nice detail.
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #293 on: April 20, 2017, 04:45:11 PM »

That's the Port side done and all sections on the aft end of the land deck have been cut out and ready for detail work when primed.
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #294 on: April 20, 2017, 04:51:44 PM »

I have made a go at making the 7 ton crane ready for the lifting arm to be installed along with some items hand made to represent the machinery which runs the crane.   
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ballastanksian

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #295 on: April 20, 2017, 10:12:01 PM »

That is a good start on the cranes Paul. Will you make the jibs from brass or have you another cunning plan to build them? I expect you are thinking about top weight more now.
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #296 on: April 24, 2017, 05:44:23 PM »

Not too fussed at the moment about top weight, as the Island is plastic card and the plane will be deck high.  Finished off the forward deck port side small  gun decks and HADC decks on the port side forward of the last  eight barrel pompom gun.  Props are now in but think I have a tight port side shaft. very tight to turn.  Could be too much grease not sure will remove and check out again.  All others seem to run freely. 


Have positioned the rudder servo and will put in the rudder shaft and check for fitting the control rods.  As for the 7 ton crane I found during my research the all the capital ships had different set ups for the crane jib.  So go two from Deans which match the ones on Lusty.  So the first one has been soldered and will file down and prime.  It fits nicely onto the crane i made from wood.  Will see what it looks like when primed and the machinery (which I still have to make) is fitted on.  If it looks the part then I will do the other side.


Drive motors have been placed on the starboard side for test fitment, Once the lower engine deck is marked up, will fit the engine cradles for all.


So lots of little jobs have been done now need to photograph the result.   
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #297 on: April 25, 2017, 09:02:41 PM »

Photos as promised. The last one shows the 7 ton crane from 1st design to the last two finished build except for the jib mounts and the gearing and other items to make up the full crane
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Paul Swainson

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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #298 on: April 29, 2017, 11:56:17 AM »

Completed the two 7 ton crane cabs, find two large gearing wheels for the base then just need to solder up the other jib and make the runners for the cables and then mount.  Finally prime and paint. Job done.
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Re: HMS Illustrious 87
« Reply #299 on: April 29, 2017, 12:04:38 PM »

Wow! Those cranes are great. There is no getting away with ignoring detail on such things and you have squeezed loads into each one  :-))

Pompoms look good as well.

Re Tight shafts, I had the same on my monitor Thursday and put it dow to injecting too much silicone grease into the left hand one. As it was an M2 shaft, the tube was small as well, so less wriggle room for the shaft to turn. I just pulled it out ten or so times wiping grease off each time until it was a bit freer and then squirted some 3-1 oil on the shaft before re-inserting and all is now well. You have larger shafts and tubes, so this should work great on your Behemoth  :}

I have learnt that with Silicone grease, less is more.
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