Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length.

[tonyH]

Try  https://faireyownersclub.co.uk/default.asp?content=boats&type=spear
 

[zooma]

Try  https://faireyownersclub.co.uk/default.asp?content=boats&type=spear
 

Hi Tony,

That is a very helpful reference for the Fairey Spearfish and the Fairey Spear that I find very interesting and helpful (for future projects!) but the Solent Spear is not covered in this reference.

Its a shame that Solent re-used the "Spear" name (in some ways) as it can cause some confusion, but your reference has helped quite a lot to differentiate between the two types.

Bob.

[tonyH]

  And you wonder why I question the number of Faireys?

[madwelshman]

I've done quite a bit of searching Bob, but never seen a brochure for a Solent Spear.
Pretty sure I haven't seen a side profile drawing either, but will have to check on the laptop, in case.


Will

[tonyH]

Maybe another daft question, but has anyone interested downloaded a copy of the Motorboat and Yachting review for Dec 2012? Generally available for a couple of quid.It may give an indication of whether it's done in more than 1 length and should certainly give a better feel for the boat.

[madwelshman]

Tony, I'm pretty sure I saw the review online and had a read of it, but to answer your question, I didn't download it.


Will

[ChrisF]

Charles Lawrence, author and Fairey Owners Club archivist, has drawn side views of both the open and closed versions of the Solent Spear. His email can be found via the club, otherwise I'll PM it to someone.

Drop him an email explaining what you want it for and for a reasonable fee he should send you a copy. Or buy a copy of his book which is excellent and will provide you with all the Fairey information that you will ever need and more.

Chris

[madwelshman]

Chris, the Fairey book is one I intend purchasing at some point.
I've read a lot of good reviews on it.

[zooma]

Maybe another daft question, but has anyone interested downloaded a copy of the Motorboat and Yachting review for Dec 2012? Generally available for a couple of quid.It may give an indication of whether it's done in more than 1 length and should certainly give a better feel for the boat.

I will take a look at that Tony............this is what came up on my search:


http://magazineexchange.co.uk/cw/motor-boat-yachting-magazine-december-2012-issue.html


I think I need to try again..........................although it is very interesting...............


Bob.

[tonyH]

Or.....  https://www.mby.com/digital-editions  give a list of options, including Zinio

[zooma]

Or.....  https://www.mby.com/digital-editions  give a list of options, including Zinio

I have found lots of nice boat shapes and ideas following your links Tony  - really good - but nothing about the Solent Spear.

[ChrisF]

Just to add a little more to this following a bit more Googling.

One of the boats for sale, not recently, states that the length is 10.67m and a width of 3.35m which is 35 feet and 10.99 feet. Other references state that since the introduction of integral bathing platforms it is usual to include the platform in the overall length.

Given that the platform isn't very wide then I think, as you guys have said, is that the fibreglass Huntsman hull is pretty much spot on for conversion. Angle the transom forward above the platform and you will have it!

Chris   

[zooma]

Just to add a little more to this following a bit more Googling.

One of the boats for sale, not recently, states that the length is 10.67m and a width of 3.35m which is 35 feet and 10.99 feet. Other references state that since the introduction of integral bathing platforms it is usual to include the platform in the overall length.

Given that the platform isn't very wide then I think, as you guys have said, is that the fibreglass Huntsman hull is pretty much spot on for conversion. Angle the transom forward above the platform and you will have it!

Chris   

Very tempting Chris 


If only we could find a copy of the brochure or some side elevation drawings to help to get the shape right this could be a winner !


I do have a spare hull............................


Bob.

[madwelshman]

A side profile drawing of a Spear would be of much help and I keep searching every now and then to see if I can find anything new and or helpful.


Chris, I'm sure I have seen somewhere a 35' listed length does include the platform.


A fibreglass 34" hull at the right price will come along at some point I'm sure and be handy to keep hold of until enough info is gathered to attempt a build.


Will

[ChrisF]

Cough, cough!!

See my post #56 above! There are side views in the Fairey book but for copyright reasons I can't show them. A jpeg or pdf would be better than the smaller images in the book.

Who's going to be first then! Won't be me as I've got other Faireys in the pipeline and I haven't got a hull!

Chris

[madwelshman]

I remember your post Chris, but I do think that Charles Lawrence can't be the only person who has drawn these and they must be out there in the abys of the world wide web somewhere.


Like yourself, I doubt if I will be the first person to attempt to build one either, I have more than enough boats to keep me occupied for a long while yet, let alone thinking about starting on any others.
The only H31 hulls I have, 34 & 46, are both wooden ones and at present, I would like to keep both at H31, but converting the 34 to Sport configuration and keeping the 46 as Aft cabin.
If a fibreglass 34" hull comes along at the right price, I would be tempted to buy it and keep it to one side, but for now, I'm happy leeting someone more skilled than myself be the first to build a Solent Spear.


Will

[zooma]

Cough, cough!!

See my post #56 above! There are side views in the Fairey book but for copyright reasons I can't show them. A jpeg or pdf would be better than the smaller images in the book.

Who's going to be first then! Won't be me as I've got other Faireys in the pipeline and I haven't got a hull!

Chris

I actually did try to find a copy of the Fairey book Chris, but "cough cough" (as you say) the price is eye watering for what it is, and at that time it was being re-printed but not yet available.

Amazon do stock the book and the last time I checked it was still unavailable.

I also checked to see if any used copies were available but at that time there were none for sale, but I will keep checking as this could produce a copy at a reasonable choice.

...but it is still a lot of wonga just to get a glimpse of a couple of small side view images.......although they could be the "missing link".

I have not seen the images in the book, but there are a few photographs available that have been shown on this thread and they do give enough information to make a reasonable  free-lance model that may be quite close, but the side elevation views would enable a more accurate rendering of the original so I will keep looking for an affordable used copy.

......and when we are allowed out to play again I will see if the local library can get a copy for me to read.

[ChrisF]

Hi Will - given that there was only such a small number produced I'm not really surprised that other drawings haven't been found and no brochure so far.

Bob - Like you I tried a number of sources when I heard about the book but it wasn't in stock anywhere. But then Dave M said he was getting one direct from the author and did I want one?

Coffee table type books are often expensive due to their limited appeal and small print runs but I don't think it's too bad  compared with the price of other things we buy! Of course it's not just about the Solent Spear drawings but all the other information - it's certainly a labour of love given all the drawings produced, many of which required boats to be measured up. I've found it an invaluable source of information and has been the inspiration for 4 of my builds including 2 I wouldn't of known anything about. No, I'm not on a cut!

Chris

[zooma]

Thanks Chris,

I have seen the side drawings you refer to now  and they look like there is enough information shown to make a good start on some side templates.

Now it's down to me to find some time and see what I can come up with.

Bob.

[jpdenver]

Greetings from this side of the pond. 

I have a question for the "group".
Does the UK have a "Fair Use Doctrine" pertaining to copyrighted materials the same way the US does? 

In the US, we may use/access/repurpose/or display copyrighted materials in certain "fair uses" as long as
the use is non-commercial, and as long as the use does not diminish the commercial value of the original
copyrighted item. 

From the US Copyright Office Web Site:
"Fair use is a legal doctrine that promotes freedom of expression by permitting the unlicensed use of copyright-protected works in certain circumstances. Section 107 of the Copyright Act provides the statutory framework for determining whether something is a fair use and identifies certain types of uses—such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research—as examples of activities that may qualify as fair use. " 

My daughter is a Contracts and Intellectual Property Attorney here in Colorado.  I asked her if posting a picture out of a copyrighted book or article
where the use was to educate about and discuss the item shown in the picture would constitute "Fair Use". 

Her answer was "Most Certainly" as long as there was not a charge for viewing the image, and if it was used for the purposes of education and research. 

So -  It seems to me that a photo of a boat that was published in a catalog of full size boats, when used as a focal point of discussion and for the
non-commercial use of designing a model, should certainly be allowed. 

The entire purpose of this forum is EDUCATION.  And the primary reason I am here is RESEARCH. 

So - while it is up the moderators to make the decisions, and we all abide with those,     
I would encourage some investigation as to what constitutes Fair Use in the UK, and if we might
be permitted to post portions of copyrighted works in order to discuss, research, and be educated. 

Just my thoughts from the back yard patio.
Regards to all,
Respectfully,
JPDenver
Jim Pope
Denver, CO USA 

[ChrisF]

Hi Jim

I don't know exactly what the situation is in the UK, though I think it's similar, without looking it up and because of that I always err on the side of caution.

Also, the author of the book has been very kind in providing me with information with regards to some of my builds and out of courtesy, nevermind copyright, I'd always ask his permission beforehand, which he was happy to give for a club article.

The other problem, is that once shown on a forum, they often get picked up by the internet and then appear in Google etc. searches over which we have little control. A number of my images show up if searches for Fairey are made which have come from my build blogs! I don't have a problem with that but I wasn't very happy a few years ago when a photograph of myself and my wife (just standing by my motorcycle!) appeared on the internet after one of our trips that I'd posted on a motorcycle forum. So I'm very careful of what I post!

So even if UK copyright does allow it I won't post any information from books etc. without permission.

Chris

[jpdenver]

Chris,
I agree that permission is always a better route to take.   Especially if you know the author/creator
of the work you are posting.  And if the product is still commercially available (and I mean from a legit source,
and not as a "used" book with a stupidly high price)  then you should encourage the purchase and use of the
work in an "original" form. 

My main point to make, and my apologies for going "off-topic", is that one should not be afraid to post an excerpt
or scan of a picture just because the original work was once published even if it is technically "copyrighted".

I will go back to my own thread now,  again - apologies for the minor hijack.
Regards,

Jim 

[ChrisF]

No problem Jim.

You weren't to know that I am in contact with the author from time to time. And yes, it is still available from him, now in updated form.

I was even more cautious because they weren't just photos but drawings actually produced by him with all the work that they entail.

Chris
 

[Stuw]

Chris,
I agree that permission is always a better route to take.   Especially if you know the author/creator
of the work you are posting.  And if the product is still commercially available (and I mean from a legit source,
and not as a "used" book with a stupidly high price)  then you should encourage the purchase and use of the
work in an "original" form. 

My main point to make, and my apologies for going "off-topic", is that one should not be afraid to post an excerpt
or scan of a picture just because the original work was once published even if it is technically "copyrighted".

I will go back to my own thread now,  again - apologies for the minor hijack.
Regards,

Jim

Good points by all. Now get back to making those screens Jim! 

[zooma]

Yes, they did 
Although, to be fair, it was a fairly crude adaptation of their popular Spearfish model...
Hope this helps.
Mark

I may have just bought one of these ugly ducklings.....by mistake!

As I was checking my eBay account I saw a picture of what looked like a perfectly good mk2 Spearfish that had been adulterated by adding a wooden box to the top of it.

When I saw that it had received no bids, I put in a cheeky offer as I thought the hull would be good for a future project, although the superstructure was probably not worth the bother of saving.

My offer was accepted and the boat was delivered safely yesterday.   Although the superstructure looks a bit "naff" it was well put together and got me thinking about how I could convert this ugly cabin into something a little more attractive, so I started looking to see what I could find to give me some ideas for a revised cabin.

I was given a couple of drawings of the full sized Fairey Spear (Not the Solent Spear) - two versions - one looked like a military type and the other is more like a leisure craft - and they both looked a lot better than this one!

My online search then found the picture of an MFA box lid - the same picture that had been previously posted on this thread by Mark, and having taken a better look at it, I realised that boat that I have just bought may not be a mk2 Spearfish with a bodged-up cabin - it may have been built from the MFA Spear kit!