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Author Topic: Metcalf 's Moonbeam  (Read 22046 times)

roycv

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #50 on: November 01, 2008, 10:38:48 AM »

Hi steamboatphil, Don't forget to increase the length of the mast to allow for this.  Sorry, sounds obvious but easily overlooked when the saw comes out.

The reviewer suggests using a tube to support the mast, looking always to save a bob where possible I experimented with diy rolled up paper tubes and with glue and stiffening varnish they have turned out to last well.

Putting the mast into a fixed tube makes the master stiffer and although it is still subject to bending forces, these are much further up the mast.

Good luck with the build,
regards Roy
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Welsh_Druid

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #51 on: November 01, 2008, 11:34:11 AM »

Roycv

I started this thread so obviously  have built and sailed a Moonbeam, Have you ? Wth the designed rigging ( but with the proviso as to materials which I have spoken about) there is absolutely no problem with the security of the mast.  There are two sailing at Llanberis and neither have had any problems despite sailing in the strong winds which we can often get there.

You say that it easier to rig with the mast through the deck. Well it would appear that you have not looked carefully enough.  By stepping the mast on the deck and with the designed rigging it is possible ( and intended) to be able to lower the mast without releasing any of the rigging screws and fold it down along the hull for easy transport. This is simply not possible with a through the deck mast.  I would guarantee to have my model ready for the water well before a similar  model with your suggested modification.

I am interested in your comments regarding balancing sails to ensure straight running.  The Moonbeam is a long keel boat. Have you ever sailed a full size long keel boat ? If you have you would know that it is virtually impossible to balance such a boat to sail on all points of sailing with neutral helm.     

Of course a fin keel boat is another matter entirely  ok2


BTW - anyone who was at the last Wicksteed Park Mayhem meeting will have seen my Moonbeam sailing in the VERY strong winds on the Saturday. Absolutely no problems with the mast security - even though it was so  bad that the rudder was damaged by the weather helm stresses. ( Long keel yacht again %))


Don B.


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nhp651

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #52 on: November 01, 2008, 12:21:08 PM »

My lips are sealed!!!??? :D ;D {-)
Thankyou, Don. :-))
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roycv

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #53 on: November 01, 2008, 01:57:30 PM »

Hi Welsh druid, interested in your response.  All of my full size sailing has been in relatively modern fin keeled yachts.  The biggest was a Moody 425, not mine, but I used to crew when possible for a friend.  But then 30foot+,  cats, down to dinghies and the sea scouts etc.

I am especially interested in your comments about long keel boats as I am near finishing a boat based on the Grand Banks Schooner Hull and as I have modified the hull (increased depth and added more topsides)  I was concerned about the balance of the boat.
I shall have a spare jib ready but won't worry about it.  So thanks on that score.

David Abbot showed me the Moonbeam he has built for Model Boats magazine, and also the way the rigging does stay with the boat.  I have several sailing boats and now make up separate sail boxes, this helps with storage and transport and protects any fragile parts.  This is especially needed for my 1 : 35 scale J class yacht. So that is where I was coming from on that point.

I will not be building Moonbeam as I have a genuine pond yacht from about 1904 or so to restore for my own use.

This is a plank on frame model with many screws and nails holding the planks onto the frames.  She is a tad smaller than Moonbeam, but otherwise very similar. She has a keel mounted mast and is gaff rigged as per Moonbeam.  She is in need of lots of TLC and I am caught between restoring her just to the Braine steering or to give her a scale appearance with R.C.  Of course the Moonbeam deck treatment does appeal or possibly that of a Pilot Cutter.

I attach a picture of her so that you can see what she  looks like.  The 100 years is the opinion of the Chairman of the Vintage model yacht group.  I thought she was from the 1930's but he said she was older, having been through a previous refit.

It is not that apparent where the mast stays / shrouds were mounted hence my particular interest in the way Moonbeam is fitted out, as I cannot fit a backstay for the same reasons.  Although the mast is keel mounted the mast deck cut out is oval and offers no support, but here I am more concerned about water getting in!

Always open to ideas on this point. 

So no Moonbeam for me but very interested in the genre.

regards Roy

 
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nhp651

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #54 on: November 01, 2008, 04:46:42 PM »

I think that model that you show us her is possibly based on the lines of a Morecambe Bay Prawner ( or Nobbie as they are known up here) and not a pilot cutter. see picture enclosed of ne built earlier.
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roycv

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #55 on: November 01, 2008, 05:32:15 PM »

Well NHP, nice to see we are now on the same hymn sheet.

Nice pictures too, VMYG Chair thought she was a class racing boat and that she had not been very successful and was put away in the loft, which accounts for her good  condition.
Which class he was not sure, as there were several classes that did not catch on.  As far as I know she reappeared in a junk shop some 40 years ago and I swapped her new owner another item for her some years ago.

There is certainly a likeness in the hull and lines to the Nobby but I am not sure she is based on a working boat because of the way the deck planks have been drawn in (Pencil).  Each drawn plank is tapered from a narrow part, bow and stern to the widest part in the middle.  I believe this was the way for 'gentlemans' yachts then.

I now have  a Thames Bawley on my list of boats to do and so am not so tempted down the fishing boat line.

No decision yet as to what to do, like I said I am first of all interested in mast rigging, the model originally used twisted picture hanging wire I am hoping to improve on that , but I keep a file of information and pictures.

Regards to all Roy



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nhp651

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #56 on: November 01, 2008, 06:06:28 PM »

well, you know that the nobbie lines were taken from a racing "yacht" of the period  don't you.
that's why they had such fine lines for a fishing boat, and the thoughts were that they could be manned by the owner and boy.just two crewmen,  and could be sailed in most weathers to and from the grounds quickly to catch market, unlike the pilot cutters of the day which needed at least 3 crewmen.
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dms toucan

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #57 on: December 13, 2008, 11:22:09 PM »

Hi
How much is Metcalf's  Moonbeam including postage to buy,
Martin
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Stavros

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #58 on: December 13, 2008, 11:40:09 PM »

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tigertiger

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #59 on: December 14, 2008, 01:40:17 AM »

Well NHP, nice to see we are now on the same hymn sheet...

There is certainly a likeness in the hull and lines to the Nobby but I am not sure she is based on a working boat because of the way the deck planks have been drawn in (Pencil).  Each drawn plank is tapered from a narrow part, bow and stern to the widest part in the middle.  I believe this was the way for 'gentlemans' yachts then.


Hi Roy
I am sorry I missed this thread before.
Looking at the above I have had some thoughts.
The drawn on deck planking may have been a result of the refit. And it is possible the new owner (c.1930) thought she was a yacht and did the deck accordingly. Or maybe just fancied changing her into a yacht, with no regards to, or understanding of, the original design.
It is also possible the masts and rigging got lost/damaged between 1900 and 1930 and the new owner rigged her as a yacht.



Nice Nobby BTW Nhp
Very nice
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Tester

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #60 on: December 14, 2008, 09:49:00 AM »

Re Sailing full sized long keel boats,
I have always found it much easier to balance than a fin keeler, we need an autohelm to keep the fin keel on a decent heading but with the old Hillyard, just a line round tiller used to do.

I always thought that was one of the advantages of a long keel, directional stability ??
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dms toucan

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #61 on: December 14, 2008, 10:11:11 AM »

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SteamboatPhil

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #62 on: December 14, 2008, 11:52:29 AM »

I think the Kit is 245, not sure about p&p, and you get everything in the box (apart for the radio and lead weights)
I see Dave is also doing the sails as a finished item for those of us that are c**p with a needle (sails are I think 100-00)   :-))
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dms toucan

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #63 on: December 15, 2008, 08:59:23 PM »

The boss has bought it for me for Christmas,
Just finished making the sails for Waverley models Galway Hooker
Then I start Moonbeam after Christmas,
Martin
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SteamboatPhil

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #64 on: December 16, 2008, 12:06:00 PM »

Have fun with the build, mines still in the box until I have decorated the hall  :((
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dms toucan

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #65 on: December 16, 2008, 11:32:54 PM »

this is what I am hoping the hooker will look like
when it's finished
Martin
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tony23

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Re: Metcalf 's Moonbeam
« Reply #66 on: June 17, 2009, 07:35:52 PM »

Hi,
    do all the Moonbeamers find the rudder adequate or would it be advised to make a slightly larger one
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