Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length.

[phil_parker]

"Competitions are still possible, they simply require the builder to state clearly exactly what they have done and that the judges are savvy enough to be able to evaluate these statements to make valid comparisons between models. A tall order maybe, but certainly not impossible but you do have to have confidence in the judgement of the judges!"

But modern technology allows the builder to take lots of photos showing progress so there shouldn't be any problem working out what came from where assuming they supply the details.

[ballastanksian]

Many years ago, I remember 2 gentlemen being snooty about a newcomers model. Why?, Because he had commercial radio gear, 'proper' modelers made their own. Times change and so must we, our boats are for enjoying, so we should do whatever it takes to enjoy our own without deriding others efforts.

I think the above comment is mainly right, to which I add that as materials and processes become available to us, they help move the goal posts of what Scratch building means. Once, all we could do was go out and carve a piece of round timber up. Then saws and wood processing systems made plywood and impregnated wood sheets available to us. Then plastic became available from a chemical proessing plant at which point various polimers such as the resins and sheet plastics, and of course their adhesives, became readily available. Now our input designing the item in a compatible file allows us to create digitally a form or collection of forms to be printed.

At the moment, we go to Shapeways because they have the accumen to purchase and operate the machines sophisticated enough to produce what we have designed in a reasonable quality, but I predict that in the next decade, we will be able to purchase second and third generation desk top printers in which we can print our own designs thus technically producing our own parts. We might not have a floor covered with shavings and primer dust, but we will still have created our own piece from our own research and creative effort.

In the end all I can say is enjoy your hobby how ever you excercise it and don't lose sleep over perameters.

[Colin Bishop]

The problem the judges would have is to weigh the various applications of modern technology against more traditional practices as there are simply too many methods to be codified and set down in writing with appropriate points weightings. It's a bit of an apples and pears situation and requires something akin to artistic judgement rather than applying a fixed set of rules.

Colin

[malcolmfrary]

The problem the judges would have is to weigh the various applications of modern technology against more traditional practices as there are simply too many methods to be codified and set down in writing with appropriate points weightings. It's a bit of an apples and pears situation and requires something akin to artistic judgement rather than applying a fixed set of rules.

Colin

Not only that, but the goalposts will keep moving.  It is the nature of the beast, technology will progress, somebody will always be first with a new idea.

[Colin Bishop]

And they will always discover a loophole in the rules which the compilers have missed.

Colin

[Netleyned]

This is my scratchbuilt boat.
I made it out of bits and pieces
Some I made, some I bought and
some fell off the model next to mine
so I stuck them on mine.
If I dont win I'm going home and not
coming to any more shows


Nef

[unbuiltnautilus]

Trophies take too much polishing...

[malcolmfrary]

Trophies take too much polishing...

.........although it is not unknown for people to actually buy trophies.

[RAAArtyGunner]

Isn't 3D printing akin to the likes of using a bandsaw, power tools, dremel etc.

In other words another tool.

Therefore it is not scratch building.

As for competitions  are they still relevant???

[Peter Fitness]

As far as I, personally, am concerned, if I build a model from plans, and it's not a kit, it's scratch built   Simple. Others may have a different view


Peter.

[essex2visuvesi]

Isn't 3D printing akin to the likes of using a bandsaw, power tools, dremel etc.

In other words another tool.

Therefore it is not scratch building.

As for competitions  are they still relevant???

There is a great deal of skill required to operate a 3D printer.  Contrary to what the advertising would lead you to believe there is still quite a bit of tinkering required on all the current range of 3D printers if you want to get the best quality/most accurate prints.

[Brian60]

I scratchbuild 95% of my models, not only because I have the skills to do so, but it is the pleasure of knowing that whatever the problem to overcome you eventually master it and move on to the next problem.

What I would say is yes you can turn your own bearings, make your own props etc etc, but why? when the commercially available ones are as good as (maybe better!) what you could produce over a period of time, you can buy off the shelf in moments and save the work for other more intricate/delicate parts.

[john44]

.........although it is not unknown for people to actually buy trophies.



Which are probably made with the use of a 3D printer


John

[ballastanksian]

I scratchbuild 95% of my models, not only because I have the skills to do so, but it is the pleasure of knowing that whatever the problem to overcome you eventually master it and move on to the next problem.

What I would say is yes you can turn your own bearings, make your own props etc etc, but why? when the commercially available ones are as good as (maybe better!) what you could produce over a period of time, you can buy off the shelf in moments and save the work for other more intricate/delicate parts.

I think that if you can get the size of props you need for the right price then definitly go for the commercial route. I bought a ship with six props though and cannot get them left handed and the right number of blades in the right diameter in brass without spending a small fortune and so am making my own props from brass sheet and bosses (well I will do once I have finished another project)

As Essex says about printers, I recall early paper printers being the same and assume that one day the 3d variety will become self calibrating.

[markjames68]

If you do the cad drawings yourself, then print them, its scratchbuilding ...simples..

[dreadnought72]

Isn't 3D printing akin to the likes of using a bandsaw, power tools, dremel etc.

In other words another tool.

Therefore it is not scratch building.

You'd prefer it if we gnawed a boat out of wood with our teeth?


Scratch building is constructing a facsimile from not-a-kit.


If it involves the option of buying-in a number of detail parts produced by 3d printing, I'd be happy to call it scratch-built.


Andy 

[carlmt]

Even the late Brian King embraced 'modern' technology in his scratch built models - I am sure I read in one of his books how he designed and had etched a brass filigree detail for one of his Victorian battleships - which obviously won some awards.....
 
As for 3D printing being or not being considered a part of scratch building, I would fall on the side of it BEING so.  When designing our first kit, the Free Enterprise ferry, I took the early decision to embrace the 3D print concept for the majority of the fittings to enable some extremely fine detail to be produced at 1:96 - an example being this winch:
 

 
And all this foredeck detail:
 

 
Now, some of this could be moulded and resin cast....but the winch most certainly cannot.
 
Is it scratch built?  Not when it is used as a part of the kit, but when I produced the prototype model then, yes, I considered it to be scratch built.  The design of the winch on the computer took me the best part of 50 hours.  I, personally, don't have the skill to make something like this by hand, but I have the skill and thought processes to design it in the computer for the machine to print it out.  Much like a skilled person on a lathe has to think through what he is doing to produce the individual parts and then assemble them.
 
Personally, I think 3D printing IS the future for the detail parts of our hobby.  There will always be those with the skill to craft by hand but, unfortunately, their number is decreasing.  The advantages of 3D printing over whitemetal casting include weight saving and increased possibility of detail.  The disadvantage at the moment is cost - there is over £125 worth of 3D fittings in each of our FEV ferry kits...a quite considerable proportion of the kit cost.....but I feel this is justified by the better detail, accuracy and strength of the fittings.
Anyone fancy having a go at scratch building this?
 

 

 

 
Every seat identical...........................
 
Pip pip!!!
Carl